Tuesday, July 08, 2003
Title: Opinion on the Supreme Court's Latest Decision Banning Sodomy Laws
I interviewed two Roman Catholic priests concerning the issue of Sodomy. I will keep both of their identities private; however, I harbor a great and deep respect for both men. One is very conservative and lives in Conneticut and I will identify him as Priest #2; the other is very liberal and lives in Australia and I will identify him as Priest #1.
I contacted both priests because I was curious as to the churches position on the matter of sodomy. Priest #1 telephoned me first and gave his opinion and said "God did not destroy the City of Sodom because there were homosexuals there. He destroyed the city because of what some of them were doing. That's where theologians get it mixed up. You see, God created all of us - straight, gay, deformed, mentally challenged, black, white, red, etc. - in His image. Not in His perfect image, but, in His permissive image. In other words, He created each person with a free will and a purpose. And He left it up to us, with a free will, to use what He gave us in the right way. If we act out His will in the wrong way, that causes Him to get angry."
He went on to explain, "Like in the days of Sodom, there are hundreds of thousands of gay people today who live decent lives in loving and monogamous relationships. But, like it was in the City of Sodom, there are also those today who, during gay-pride celebrations, dance in the streets, wear out-landish costumes, act and dress lewdly in front of children, grope and grab the first man they see and kiss and grope each other on public streets in front of children, etc. That is the same thing that was going on in the City of Sodom. That is why God destroyed the city, because they used how He made them in the wrong way. When God sent the angels to warn the people about His wrath, the ones who wanted to be saved, left. And, many of those who left were decent, law abiding gay and heterosexual people - all who loved and worshiped God. Surprisingly, most gay people today are against of how gay people are being portrayed on the news and how these celebrations are carried out. That is why most gay people do not participate."
He went further, and said, "On the other hand, there is the relationship of Jesus and John the Disciple. John the Disciple was known amidst the other disciples as the friend of Christ. But, what that means, is still in debate. However, Jesus also loved John the Disciple so much, that He gave the beginning of His gospels to John the Baptist (who He never met); and gave the end or revelation of His gospels to John the Divine. Simple put, Jesus loved the name "John." He even went further to say that there is no man greater that was born of a woman than John the Baptist. Even in the Old Testament, King David's love for Jonathan was much greater than that of any of the 700 women he had in his harem. And, whenever Jesus and the disciples were together and laid to rest, John the Disciple always rested his head on Jesus' chest. It was a clean, pure, decent, loving, loyal and monogamous (but, open) relationship. And, all of the other disciples honored Jesus and John because of that. What hurt homosexuals today, however, is that theologians have carried the sinful acts of lewd and indecent gay men of Sodom in their hearts down through the ages as a means to teach that homosexuality - as a whole - is evil, vile,and sinful. But, in their ignorance, they missed the reason why God destroyed Sodom. What happened in Sodom, is still happening today. But, we must open up our hearts and minds and stop being so judgmentally ignorant and understand that God created all of us in His image. And, whatever that path that God laid out for us to take in life, we must learn to perform each task set before us with passion, love decently and in the Will of God - not in our own will or the will of man. For example, it is my belief that God created black people so that white people can understand someone beyond what they are used to seeing. God created white people so that black people could know the love of forgiveness. God created straight people so that gay people would know and understand a freedom of fear. God created gay people so that straight people would know God's plan of acceptance and understanding. In other words, we are all a part of God's Divine plan. But, He left it up to us as to how we choose to handle what He gave us and how He created us. So, use it well."
Priest #2 responded, and said, "I found Priest #1's opinion very interesting. I'd be happy to give you not my opinion on the matter, but rather, what I believe to be the truth as taught by the Catholic Churh since her beginnings. Priest #1 is right, there is a difference between homosexual orientation and homosexual acts. In the first case, one has a predominant sexual attraction to persons of the same sex. What he or she does with that same-sex attraction makes all the difference. I beleive that most people with this orientation find it a burden and a struggle, and I have great compassion and sensitivity for them. The latter case is different. A homosexual act is (as the Catechism of the Catholic Church teaches) intrinsically disordered and sinful. At the same time, however, we can't forget that if a heterosexual person engages in a heterosexual act before marriage, that act is also sinful."
Priest #2 said further, "I'm not sure I follow or agree with Priest #1's words. God allows certain things; for example, He allowed Hitler to do what he did, He allowed Adam and Eve to sin, He allowed the Romans to kill His Son, Jesus, etc. But, by allowing things, God does not necessarily make them happen. So, to say that God creates homosexual persons, is tricky. There is NO evidence to show that homosexuality is determined by a gene or some physical cause - none at all. It is most likely a person's environment (and especially the role of the father) that can do the most to shape a person's sexaul orientation. So, God allows all of this to happen, but, just as He does not make a child to be born blind or deformed, He does not make homosexual persons, per se. Both are contra nature, and therefore, disordered, but, the person with the disorder is not blamed for that disorder. The Catechism does not go into detail about this matter, but, it is helpful in that it contains all the teachings of the Catholic Church. I think that the Supreme Court's decision was, at best, very bad law adn a bad precedent. At worst, it is the beginning of some socially disastrous consequences for our country. But, things like this make me pray more, so I can't complain."
My response to Priest #2 was as follows: "Thank you for responding so quickly. I have never written about the subject of homosexuality and do not believe that I ever will. Like you said, it is a tricky area. I think, however, that the jury is still out on what it all really means. And, it is for that reason why 99% of all men who have these feelings choose to hide them and/or will never admit to them. And, some will even go as far as denouncing the life-style as evil and sinful to mask what they are really feeling inside. I've learned that, for them, it's a protection mechanism for self-preservation. And, I do not blame those who choose to do that. Because, society - especially our churches - are ignorant to the mysteries of the true translations of the gospels; and only know what has been handed down to them through the ages by men who lived misserable lives, therefore, wrote laws to assure that modern men would be destined to suffer the same fate.
I went further to share with Priest #2, "I do not trust old or new translations of the gospels, because they are nothing more than another mans' opinions as to how we should think, act, live, etc. I have learned, instead, to trust what God reveals to me in my heart through prayer and fasting. This is partly why, after learning of the Supreme Court's decision, I asked Priest #1 in Australia to telephone me about the matter. And, he did. It was an enlightening conversation. Maybe, and maybe someday soon, God will also direct me to write more about the subject. But, until He does, I will leave the matter alone and hang on to what He's already revealed to me in my heart."
I said further, "Cocnerning your comment about there is no direct evidence that would support a gene-link to homosexuality, you are wrong. As a matter of record, there is. An acquaintance is a physician and practices in the State of Georgia. He stated that there are several detailed studies that were just released to the AMA just last year that definitely shows a vast difference in brain structure that identify homosexuality and heterosexuality and can now be identified in fetuses even before they are born; and doctors can tell a parent now whether their child will be either homosexual or heterosexual. After learning about this, I contacted one of my resources, a research doctor at the Common Wealth Medical College in Richmond. And to my amazement, he verified what my doctor-acquaintance disclosed to me. As a matter of fact, he went further and went into more detail and stated that many parents, who had the testing done on their unborn fetuses and found the gene to be present, had abortions. That is the down side. As a matter of fact, there was a movie made about the subject which starred Faye Donoway."
I went further, "I agree with you, however, that the decision that the Supreme Court passed down will probably have devastating consequences. Because, many gay people will probably not use that decision to educate the public in a positive way. In fact, when I see gay men and women dancing in the streets dressed in out-landish costumes, it sickens me to no end. It reminds me of what I read in the Bible concerning what also happened in the City of Sodom and why God had to destroy the city. But fortunately, those few do not represent the majority of homosexuals who are living decent, lawful and monogamous lives and serving in all realms of our society world wide in governments, medical fields, education and the military."
I interviewed two Roman Catholic priests concerning the issue of Sodomy. I will keep both of their identities private; however, I harbor a great and deep respect for both men. One is very conservative and lives in Conneticut and I will identify him as Priest #2; the other is very liberal and lives in Australia and I will identify him as Priest #1.
I contacted both priests because I was curious as to the churches position on the matter of sodomy. Priest #1 telephoned me first and gave his opinion and said "God did not destroy the City of Sodom because there were homosexuals there. He destroyed the city because of what some of them were doing. That's where theologians get it mixed up. You see, God created all of us - straight, gay, deformed, mentally challenged, black, white, red, etc. - in His image. Not in His perfect image, but, in His permissive image. In other words, He created each person with a free will and a purpose. And He left it up to us, with a free will, to use what He gave us in the right way. If we act out His will in the wrong way, that causes Him to get angry."
He went on to explain, "Like in the days of Sodom, there are hundreds of thousands of gay people today who live decent lives in loving and monogamous relationships. But, like it was in the City of Sodom, there are also those today who, during gay-pride celebrations, dance in the streets, wear out-landish costumes, act and dress lewdly in front of children, grope and grab the first man they see and kiss and grope each other on public streets in front of children, etc. That is the same thing that was going on in the City of Sodom. That is why God destroyed the city, because they used how He made them in the wrong way. When God sent the angels to warn the people about His wrath, the ones who wanted to be saved, left. And, many of those who left were decent, law abiding gay and heterosexual people - all who loved and worshiped God. Surprisingly, most gay people today are against of how gay people are being portrayed on the news and how these celebrations are carried out. That is why most gay people do not participate."
He went further, and said, "On the other hand, there is the relationship of Jesus and John the Disciple. John the Disciple was known amidst the other disciples as the friend of Christ. But, what that means, is still in debate. However, Jesus also loved John the Disciple so much, that He gave the beginning of His gospels to John the Baptist (who He never met); and gave the end or revelation of His gospels to John the Divine. Simple put, Jesus loved the name "John." He even went further to say that there is no man greater that was born of a woman than John the Baptist. Even in the Old Testament, King David's love for Jonathan was much greater than that of any of the 700 women he had in his harem. And, whenever Jesus and the disciples were together and laid to rest, John the Disciple always rested his head on Jesus' chest. It was a clean, pure, decent, loving, loyal and monogamous (but, open) relationship. And, all of the other disciples honored Jesus and John because of that. What hurt homosexuals today, however, is that theologians have carried the sinful acts of lewd and indecent gay men of Sodom in their hearts down through the ages as a means to teach that homosexuality - as a whole - is evil, vile,and sinful. But, in their ignorance, they missed the reason why God destroyed Sodom. What happened in Sodom, is still happening today. But, we must open up our hearts and minds and stop being so judgmentally ignorant and understand that God created all of us in His image. And, whatever that path that God laid out for us to take in life, we must learn to perform each task set before us with passion, love decently and in the Will of God - not in our own will or the will of man. For example, it is my belief that God created black people so that white people can understand someone beyond what they are used to seeing. God created white people so that black people could know the love of forgiveness. God created straight people so that gay people would know and understand a freedom of fear. God created gay people so that straight people would know God's plan of acceptance and understanding. In other words, we are all a part of God's Divine plan. But, He left it up to us as to how we choose to handle what He gave us and how He created us. So, use it well."
Priest #2 responded, and said, "I found Priest #1's opinion very interesting. I'd be happy to give you not my opinion on the matter, but rather, what I believe to be the truth as taught by the Catholic Churh since her beginnings. Priest #1 is right, there is a difference between homosexual orientation and homosexual acts. In the first case, one has a predominant sexual attraction to persons of the same sex. What he or she does with that same-sex attraction makes all the difference. I beleive that most people with this orientation find it a burden and a struggle, and I have great compassion and sensitivity for them. The latter case is different. A homosexual act is (as the Catechism of the Catholic Church teaches) intrinsically disordered and sinful. At the same time, however, we can't forget that if a heterosexual person engages in a heterosexual act before marriage, that act is also sinful."
Priest #2 said further, "I'm not sure I follow or agree with Priest #1's words. God allows certain things; for example, He allowed Hitler to do what he did, He allowed Adam and Eve to sin, He allowed the Romans to kill His Son, Jesus, etc. But, by allowing things, God does not necessarily make them happen. So, to say that God creates homosexual persons, is tricky. There is NO evidence to show that homosexuality is determined by a gene or some physical cause - none at all. It is most likely a person's environment (and especially the role of the father) that can do the most to shape a person's sexaul orientation. So, God allows all of this to happen, but, just as He does not make a child to be born blind or deformed, He does not make homosexual persons, per se. Both are contra nature, and therefore, disordered, but, the person with the disorder is not blamed for that disorder. The Catechism does not go into detail about this matter, but, it is helpful in that it contains all the teachings of the Catholic Church. I think that the Supreme Court's decision was, at best, very bad law adn a bad precedent. At worst, it is the beginning of some socially disastrous consequences for our country. But, things like this make me pray more, so I can't complain."
My response to Priest #2 was as follows: "Thank you for responding so quickly. I have never written about the subject of homosexuality and do not believe that I ever will. Like you said, it is a tricky area. I think, however, that the jury is still out on what it all really means. And, it is for that reason why 99% of all men who have these feelings choose to hide them and/or will never admit to them. And, some will even go as far as denouncing the life-style as evil and sinful to mask what they are really feeling inside. I've learned that, for them, it's a protection mechanism for self-preservation. And, I do not blame those who choose to do that. Because, society - especially our churches - are ignorant to the mysteries of the true translations of the gospels; and only know what has been handed down to them through the ages by men who lived misserable lives, therefore, wrote laws to assure that modern men would be destined to suffer the same fate.
I went further to share with Priest #2, "I do not trust old or new translations of the gospels, because they are nothing more than another mans' opinions as to how we should think, act, live, etc. I have learned, instead, to trust what God reveals to me in my heart through prayer and fasting. This is partly why, after learning of the Supreme Court's decision, I asked Priest #1 in Australia to telephone me about the matter. And, he did. It was an enlightening conversation. Maybe, and maybe someday soon, God will also direct me to write more about the subject. But, until He does, I will leave the matter alone and hang on to what He's already revealed to me in my heart."
I said further, "Cocnerning your comment about there is no direct evidence that would support a gene-link to homosexuality, you are wrong. As a matter of record, there is. An acquaintance is a physician and practices in the State of Georgia. He stated that there are several detailed studies that were just released to the AMA just last year that definitely shows a vast difference in brain structure that identify homosexuality and heterosexuality and can now be identified in fetuses even before they are born; and doctors can tell a parent now whether their child will be either homosexual or heterosexual. After learning about this, I contacted one of my resources, a research doctor at the Common Wealth Medical College in Richmond. And to my amazement, he verified what my doctor-acquaintance disclosed to me. As a matter of fact, he went further and went into more detail and stated that many parents, who had the testing done on their unborn fetuses and found the gene to be present, had abortions. That is the down side. As a matter of fact, there was a movie made about the subject which starred Faye Donoway."
I went further, "I agree with you, however, that the decision that the Supreme Court passed down will probably have devastating consequences. Because, many gay people will probably not use that decision to educate the public in a positive way. In fact, when I see gay men and women dancing in the streets dressed in out-landish costumes, it sickens me to no end. It reminds me of what I read in the Bible concerning what also happened in the City of Sodom and why God had to destroy the city. But fortunately, those few do not represent the majority of homosexuals who are living decent, lawful and monogamous lives and serving in all realms of our society world wide in governments, medical fields, education and the military."
